Walter question on skin thickening
Moderators: Julia, Walter, Administrator
Walter question on skin thickening
Walter can you explain your experience with killing mites and skin thickening, and what you know in regard to how long it takes. Have you personally seen any cases or is this just anecdotal and based on what you have been told by someone.
Re: Walter question on skin thickening
Walter I ask you the skin thickening question, because I can't find any sources about it fading away after mite treatments, so my hope rests completely on your statements. Let me just emphasize, that yes I believe ZZ kills mites, and yes mites are my problem. I do not have really rhinophyma now, but I have unfamiliar thin yellowish skin on the skin on the sides of my nose, so I know this is skin thickening.
I found the following study (and yes I understand it will take longer than 2 months, and probably at least 6 months, then a maintence):
http://content.karger.com/ProdukteDB/pr ... tNr=228674
Background: Permethrin 5% cream used against human ectoparasites suggests that it may be effective in papulopustular rosacea. Methods: This study included 63 patients diagnosed as having papulopustular rosacea based on the clinical and histological findings. Patients were randomly assigned into permethrin (n = 23), metronidazole (n = 20) and placebo (n = 20) groups. Scores of erythema, telangiectasia, edema and rhinophyma and the numbers of papules, pustules, inflammatory nodules and Demodex folliculorum were determined. Twenty-three patients were given permethrin 5% cream (Zalvor 5% skin cream®), 20 patients metronidazole 0.75% gel (Roza gel®) and 20 patients placebo cream (Basis cream®), in packages looking identical to those of metronidazole and permethrin creams, and were recommended to apply them to their faces twice a day. All patients were also given SPF 20 cream for protection against sunlight. Two months of treatment were planned, and the patients were invited to the clinic for fortnightly controls. Scores of erythema, telangiectasia, edema and rhinophyma and the numbers of papules, pustules, inflammatory nodules and D. folliculorum were recorded at each visit. The mean scores of erythema and the mean numbers of papules, pustules and D. folliculorum were determined at baseline and on days 15, 30, 45 and 60. Side effects were also detected. Results: The effect of permethrin 5% cream on D. folliculorum was superior to that of metronidazole 0.75% gel. The effect of permethrin 5% cream on erythema and papules was found to be more effective than placebo and as effective as metronidazole 0.75% gel. However, it had no effect on telangiectasia, rhinophyma and pustules. Conclusion: It can be concluded that the application of permethrin 5% cream twice daily for 2 months can be as effective and reliable as metronidazole in the treatment of rosacea and a greater benefit can be gained when it is combined with other systemic and/or topical treatments.
I found the following study (and yes I understand it will take longer than 2 months, and probably at least 6 months, then a maintence):
http://content.karger.com/ProdukteDB/pr ... tNr=228674
Background: Permethrin 5% cream used against human ectoparasites suggests that it may be effective in papulopustular rosacea. Methods: This study included 63 patients diagnosed as having papulopustular rosacea based on the clinical and histological findings. Patients were randomly assigned into permethrin (n = 23), metronidazole (n = 20) and placebo (n = 20) groups. Scores of erythema, telangiectasia, edema and rhinophyma and the numbers of papules, pustules, inflammatory nodules and Demodex folliculorum were determined. Twenty-three patients were given permethrin 5% cream (Zalvor 5% skin cream®), 20 patients metronidazole 0.75% gel (Roza gel®) and 20 patients placebo cream (Basis cream®), in packages looking identical to those of metronidazole and permethrin creams, and were recommended to apply them to their faces twice a day. All patients were also given SPF 20 cream for protection against sunlight. Two months of treatment were planned, and the patients were invited to the clinic for fortnightly controls. Scores of erythema, telangiectasia, edema and rhinophyma and the numbers of papules, pustules, inflammatory nodules and D. folliculorum were recorded at each visit. The mean scores of erythema and the mean numbers of papules, pustules and D. folliculorum were determined at baseline and on days 15, 30, 45 and 60. Side effects were also detected. Results: The effect of permethrin 5% cream on D. folliculorum was superior to that of metronidazole 0.75% gel. The effect of permethrin 5% cream on erythema and papules was found to be more effective than placebo and as effective as metronidazole 0.75% gel. However, it had no effect on telangiectasia, rhinophyma and pustules. Conclusion: It can be concluded that the application of permethrin 5% cream twice daily for 2 months can be as effective and reliable as metronidazole in the treatment of rosacea and a greater benefit can be gained when it is combined with other systemic and/or topical treatments.
Re: Walter question on skin thickening
Hello
Well, of course, most I know is from what our clients are telling me regarding their results but no reason this should not be accurate.
recovery depends how long the skin problem is already progressing, first the mites need to be removed so the cause of the disease is gone.
then actually, the skin needs to heal it selves, the immune system needs to stop reacting onto the mites allergens, this can take
easily one year so it is important to keep the mites away by using a maintenance treatment but that’s not a big deal,
using two times a month in the evening is already enough (after the mites are eliminated in the first place)
I have a friend who had a bad swollen nose (so I saw personally) , after a year and a half his nose was almost back to normal.
Most of the people we had feedback from reported that the skin becomes more and more back to normal in time.
You cannot expect though, that if the disease is already so progressed that there are already bigger lumps, that they will disappear
completely, the only way in this case is remove by surgery but in any case, you need to stop the problem first by eliminating the mites.
Regarding the used products you are mentioning, there exists no better product for the moment then the ZZ ointment, believe me.
Walter
Well, of course, most I know is from what our clients are telling me regarding their results but no reason this should not be accurate.
recovery depends how long the skin problem is already progressing, first the mites need to be removed so the cause of the disease is gone.
then actually, the skin needs to heal it selves, the immune system needs to stop reacting onto the mites allergens, this can take
easily one year so it is important to keep the mites away by using a maintenance treatment but that’s not a big deal,
using two times a month in the evening is already enough (after the mites are eliminated in the first place)
I have a friend who had a bad swollen nose (so I saw personally) , after a year and a half his nose was almost back to normal.
Most of the people we had feedback from reported that the skin becomes more and more back to normal in time.
You cannot expect though, that if the disease is already so progressed that there are already bigger lumps, that they will disappear
completely, the only way in this case is remove by surgery but in any case, you need to stop the problem first by eliminating the mites.
Regarding the used products you are mentioning, there exists no better product for the moment then the ZZ ointment, believe me.
Walter
Re: Walter question on skin thickening
Of course if tumors show up I won't expect ZZ to do anything at that point. I have had my disease for a year. I recently went to an expert in Europe that specializes in demodicosis, and has outlined a long term treatment for me. I have a lot of ZZ too. I have to say though that it is impossible to completely eliminate demodex from your face. You can only reduce demodex density (Dd) to normal levels, so you can heal. But it is clear from reading peoples' posts here and elsewhere that the problem can come back, and it is not because they were infested by pillows or dogs, it is because demodex is part of normal skin flora. Of course, some can fend off the mites again...
I know nothing about Zinc oxide, but all of these are natural anti-parasitic treatments:
Sublimed sulfur
Boric acid 2%
salicylic acid 0.5%
Dimethiconum Composite
I recently found Dimenthiconum lice treatment in the store.
I think ZZ is a great product, but I wish (of course) it was a little cheaper.
But regarding your experience with skin thickening I am more curious, because like the photo on the site, the severe rosacea woman had a red swollen nose, and apparently superficial red lesions. My nose is not as red now and no red bumps, thanks to ZZ and Permethrin. I have read that you mention hyperplasia will fade away though. I don't believe I have sebaceous hyperplasia, it is just this thin unfamiliar skin that concerns me. I will let you know if it fades away in a year, but I wonder what people here are talking about in regard to noses. I think more specifics on certain types of damage caused by the mite should be addressed. I have also another symptom that has not been noted anywhere... I was getting movement/muscle twitch under my eyebrow and in my nose. I can't figure out if it is a lot of mites, or maybe their bacteria effect sodium channels which causes a twitch. My skin biopsy showed first a few mites, and then a biopsy went deeper right after, and showed even more. This was after I treated myself everyday for two months. That is over 20 mites in a small section of my cheek. Also, the expert noted that in cases with heavy infestation of the face, they found a lot of mites in the scalp, so I have to treat my scalp too. I don't think it is good enough to only treat the face. Something should be applied on the scalp overnight, at least twice a week, as well. That is just my opinion though.
I know nothing about Zinc oxide, but all of these are natural anti-parasitic treatments:
Sublimed sulfur
Boric acid 2%
salicylic acid 0.5%
Dimethiconum Composite
I recently found Dimenthiconum lice treatment in the store.
I think ZZ is a great product, but I wish (of course) it was a little cheaper.
But regarding your experience with skin thickening I am more curious, because like the photo on the site, the severe rosacea woman had a red swollen nose, and apparently superficial red lesions. My nose is not as red now and no red bumps, thanks to ZZ and Permethrin. I have read that you mention hyperplasia will fade away though. I don't believe I have sebaceous hyperplasia, it is just this thin unfamiliar skin that concerns me. I will let you know if it fades away in a year, but I wonder what people here are talking about in regard to noses. I think more specifics on certain types of damage caused by the mite should be addressed. I have also another symptom that has not been noted anywhere... I was getting movement/muscle twitch under my eyebrow and in my nose. I can't figure out if it is a lot of mites, or maybe their bacteria effect sodium channels which causes a twitch. My skin biopsy showed first a few mites, and then a biopsy went deeper right after, and showed even more. This was after I treated myself everyday for two months. That is over 20 mites in a small section of my cheek. Also, the expert noted that in cases with heavy infestation of the face, they found a lot of mites in the scalp, so I have to treat my scalp too. I don't think it is good enough to only treat the face. Something should be applied on the scalp overnight, at least twice a week, as well. That is just my opinion though.
Re: Walter question on skin thickening
For example, in the "Do I have Demodex" section of your website, there are pictures of examples of people with demodex problems. The oriental man has rhinophyma to a stage I doubt ZZ could help. But what about the noses of the women? The oriental Womans' nose is more like my problem, thicker nose skin, with yellowish skin.
Re: Walter question on skin thickening
Not true, the ZZ completely eliminates demodex mites if you use it for a long enough timeit is impossible to completely eliminate demodex from your face
and yes, if one is vulnerable for them, it is easy to become re-infected from other people, but doing
a maintenance treatment in this case will keep them away.
Demodex mites are not a normal part of the skin flora, it are parasites, not symbiotic creatures.it is because demodex is part of normal skin flora
It is not that because so many people have them it is ok, do you think flees are a normal part of your skin flora?
go back in time and almost everybody had them.
Walter
Re: Walter question on skin thickening
I agree completely that demodex has no benefit for the human, and they are indeed parasites, so let me correct my statement by taking out the word "normal". From what I've read it seems we get them after birth by rubbing up against people. I am aware we aren't born with them. However, I am not convinced you can completely get rid of them. Theoretically this should be possible, but I am not convinced of this. I treated myself with everything under the sun including ZZ for 2 months, and the biopsy I had was cm^2 and showed over 21 mites. Now think of my entire head... I realize I haven't treated long enough but...Walter wrote: Not true, the ZZ completely eliminates demodex mites if you use it for a long enough time
and yes, if one is vulnerable for them, it is easy to become re-infected from other people, but doing
a maintenance treatment in this case will keep them away.
Demodex mites are not a normal part of the skin flora, it are parasites, not symbiotic creatures.
It is not that because so many people have them it is ok, do you think flees are a normal part of your skin flora?
go back in time and almost everybody had them.
Walter
Regarding rhinophyma, you often seem to talk about a red swollen nose, but this isn't so much what I'm referring to. I have read through pretty much every testimonial, but I yet to find anything about skin thickening, so you must be mentioning something you received in a private e-mail or something from the creator of the ZZ. I am not talking about the superficial red lesions that occur in demodicosis either, like in the woman with severe rosacea. I will not give up treating as long as I have this disease, but I am not clear on what is reversible.
Dr. Zhao Zhongzhou himself says:
"If not treated properly with correct medication, the inflammation will reoccur, In more serious cases, the epidermis, or the appearance of skin, will be permanently injured, scars resembling the texture of orange skin will be left, hair follicle pores will be enlarged, and the skin will become thicker due to hyperplasia."